- EpiData-list - University of Manitoba Mailing Lists

Next build of EpiData Analysis ready for test before public release
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 17 Mar '06

17 Mar '06

The current test build of analysis (build 68) will be put out for general download unless some of you find serious problems. We know there are still some issues being tested, e.g. the rewriting of the table module is not completed and the handling of missing values in comma separated files. But other aspects are final, e.g. the development of detailed help files for a number of main commands and removal of some floating point error bugs. Regards Jens Lauritsen

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How to read CSV files (missing versus zero)
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

As the discussion has rolled out I am sure we can all agree that "Missing data and zero are two totally different things and should never be interchanged. " Obviously I never intended to have a meaning other than stated with the sentence above. The problem which arose is however that when creating comma separated files it turns out that the contents of the files varies a lot depending on which system is creating the data files. Therefore I asked : > In other words the question is how to read ",.," should it be: > Option 1: as 0.0 (which is current behaviour) > or Option 2: . My worry was that around the world in some places some systems export a zero as ",.," whereas in other areas as ",," >From the messages added by users I decided to implement the latter option. That is in one of the next builds you will see that: Any content of a comma separated file will be imported as : missing if the content of the csv file is: ,., or ,, for a given field. A similar question is related to reading of "empty" boolean fields. E.g. access exports these as "FALSE" or "NO", not as "no value". There is only one cure to this type of problem: The software should not be given control of standards. The standard should be settled by the user or the user community. Regards Jens Lauritsen. EpiData Association

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Re: Hystory/Visit/Treatment related files
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

Hi, Yves' answer is quite good. My only concern is whether bloodpresure should be recorded in a independent file (BLOOD.REC) or it is a field in the Visits.rec one. As far as I understood blood presure levels are going to be measured in each visits. If that is the case, in my opinion blood presure should be field of the visits.rec file. Treatment, I dare say, should be recorded in a independent file since it shouldn't change with every visit. What do you think? Greetings, Pedro Pedro Arias Bohigas John Ericssons gatan, 12 5 tr 112 22 Stockholm Sweden Phone (cell) 0734421130 Phone (international calls)+46734421130 > Dear epidata > > I would like to set up a database for a clinic. The 4 rec files are > history, visit, bloodresults and treatment. The clinicnr of the patient > is the unique id that I would like to carry over between these rec > files. Secondly the number of records for visits/bloodresults/treatment > for each patient with a specific clinicnr can be more than one over > time. However history only has to be completed once (can be mother > file?). > > When creating a relational database am I right if I say that I cannot > keep clinicnr as the unique nr in every rec file as that will only allow > ONE record with that clinicnr and I need to be able to do multiple > records eg for visits on that one clinicnr. The House.rec etc example > does not really help me with this as the visit rec file is the last rec > file. I have 3 "children files" following one after another. > > Please help with the check files to relate these 4 files whilst keeping > clinicnr as the unique id but allowing multiple records per clinicnr. > > Thanks > > Paul > > > > Prof Paul Rheeder > > Division of Clinical Epidemiology > > Faculty of Health Sciences > > University of Pretoria > > PO Box 667 > > Pretoria 0001 > > Tel 27 12 354 1488 > > Fax 27 12 354 1489 > > > > > > Hello Paul, > > Yes, you're right: in each "child file" there must be the clinicnr > (declared as "key") and, in your case, there must be also another > id-number in each child file declared as "key unique". > Usually, it's convenient to define a "visitnr" in each child file and to > concatenate "clinicnr | visitnr" in a unique id-number > > As far as the relations between files are concerned, I would recommend > to relate each child file to the master file (an not to relate the > first child file to the master file, then the second child file to the > first child file, and so forth). Please note that this can be done > anywhere in the master file (i.e. at a different place for each child > file or at a same place). Please note also that you can decide to open > a child file or not, according to the result of a question. > > Hereafter is an example of what you can do. Hope it helps. > > Happy computing! > > Yves > > > ************ > Master file (for example clinic.chk for clinic.rec file) > ************ > > CLINICNR (better if defined as string) > key unique > mustenter > END > > VAR1 > ... > END > > > VARXXX > ... > AFTER ENTRY > HELP "do you want to enter visit data for this patient? (Y/N)" > KEYS="YN" TYPE=CONFIRMATION > IF RESULTVALUE=2 THEN > GOTO nextvar > ELSE > IF RESULTVALUE=1 THEN > RELATE clinicnr VISIT.REC > ENDIF > ENDIF > END > END > > ... > > > VARYYY > ... > AFTER ENTRY > HELP "do you want to enter blood data for this patient? (Y/N)" > KEYS="YN" TYPE=CONFIRMATION > IF RESULTVALUE=2 THEN > GOTO nextvar > ELSE > IF RESULTVALUE=1 THEN > RELATE clinicnr BLOOD.REC > ENDIF > ENDIF > END > END > > > etc. > > > ************ > Child file (for example visit.chk for the visit.rec file) > ************ > > CLINICNR (string variable) > key > END > > ** please note that the above field will be automatically filled ** > > VISITNR (string variable) > key > mustenter > END > > VISITID (string variable) > key unique > BEFORE ENTRY > let visitid=clinicnr+visitnr > goto nextvar > END > END >

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RELATE QUERY
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

Dear epidata I would like to set up a database for a clinic. The 4 rec files are history, visit, bloodresults and treatment. The clinicnr of the patient is the unique id that I would like to carry over between these rec files. Secondly the number of records for visits/bloodresults/treatment for each patient with a specific clinicnr can be more than one over time. However history only has to be completed once (can be mother file?). When creating a relational database am I right if I say that I cannot keep clinicnr as the unique nr in every rec file as that will only allow ONE record with that clinicnr and I need to be able to do multiple records eg for visits on that one clinicnr. The House.rec etc example does not really help me with this as the visit rec file is the last rec file. I have 3 "children files" following one after another. Please help with the check files to relate these 4 files whilst keeping clinicnr as the unique id but allowing multiple records per clinicnr. Thanks Paul Prof Paul Rheeder Division of Clinical Epidemiology Faculty of Health Sciences University of Pretoria PO Box 667 Pretoria 0001 Tel 27 12 354 1488 Fax 27 12 354 1489

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RE: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis readaCSV(CommaSeparated File)
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

Missing data and zero are two totally different things and should never be interchanged. If you are analyzing data, missing values are automatically excluded (unless you specifically request them not to be). If the missing values are defaulted to zero they would be included in the analysis and drastically alter the analysis results. Cheers, Jackie -----Original Message----- From: epidata-list-bounces(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list-bounces@lists.umanitoba.ca] On Behalf Of epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Sent: 14 March 2006 10:29 To: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Subject: RE: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis readaCSV(CommaSeparated File) On my point of view also, there is no way for a missing data to be treated as a zero. Gilles -----Message d'origine----- De : epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list@lists.umanitoba.ca] Envoyé : dimanche 12 mars 2006 20:59 À : epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Objet : AW: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read aCSV(CommaSeparated File) I also agree that missing is not equal to zero. I hope the vote is clear on that marcel ________________________________ Von: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list@lists.umanitoba.ca] Gesendet: Fr 10.03.2006 13:57 An: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Betreff: RE: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV(CommaSeparated File) Hello! I totally agree with you Max on this question. Cheers, Bellinda -----Original Message----- From: epidata-list-bounces(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list-bounces@lists.umanitoba.ca] On Behalf Of epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 6:35 PM To: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Subject: Re: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV (CommaSeparated File) Hello Jens, I would strongly argue that a missing is a missing and a 0 (zero) is a very distinct value - hence never turn missings into zero by default... or in short: Option 2 Bests Max On 10 Mar 2006, at 10:21, epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca wrote: > A question has come up. > > Please consider how you find reading of a CSV file in analysis > appropriate: > > > In a csv file the following data is found: > id, s, pos, sex, ill > 1,.,.,f,0 > 2...... etc (rest of records) > > The data in line can be interpreted in two ways: > Option 1: > ID= 1 > s= 0.0 > pos=0.0 > SEX = "f" ill = 0 > > Option 2: > ID= 1 > s= . > pos=. > SEX = "f" ill = 0 > > In other words the question is how to read ",.," should it be: > Option 1: as 0.0 (which is current behaviour) > or Option 2: . > > Any comments on desired behaviour appreciated. > > regards > > Jens Lauritsen > EpiData Association > _______________________________________________ > EpiData-list mailing list > EpiData-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca > http://lists.umanitoba.ca/mailman/listinfo/epidata-list _______________________________________________ EpiData-list mailing list EpiData-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca http://lists.umanitoba.ca/mailman/listinfo/epidata-list _______________________________________________ EpiData-list mailing list EpiData-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca http://lists.umanitoba.ca/mailman/listinfo/epidata-list

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RE: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read aCSV(CommaSeparated File)
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

On my point of view also, there is no way for a missing data to be treated as a zero. Gilles -----Message d'origine----- De : epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list@lists.umanitoba.ca] Envoyé : dimanche 12 mars 2006 20:59 À : epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Objet : AW: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read aCSV(CommaSeparated File) I also agree that missing is not equal to zero. I hope the vote is clear on that marcel ________________________________ Von: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list@lists.umanitoba.ca] Gesendet: Fr 10.03.2006 13:57 An: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Betreff: RE: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV(CommaSeparated File) Hello! I totally agree with you Max on this question. Cheers, Bellinda -----Original Message----- From: epidata-list-bounces(a)lists.umanitoba.ca [mailto:epidata-list-bounces@lists.umanitoba.ca] On Behalf Of epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 6:35 PM To: epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca Subject: Re: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV (CommaSeparated File) Hello Jens, I would strongly argue that a missing is a missing and a 0 (zero) is a very distinct value - hence never turn missings into zero by default... or in short: Option 2 Bests Max On 10 Mar 2006, at 10:21, epidata-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca wrote: > A question has come up. > > Please consider how you find reading of a CSV file in analysis > appropriate: > > > In a csv file the following data is found: > id, s, pos, sex, ill > 1,.,.,f,0 > 2...... etc (rest of records) > > The data in line can be interpreted in two ways: > Option 1: > ID= 1 > s= 0.0 > pos=0.0 > SEX = "f" ill = 0 > > Option 2: > ID= 1 > s= . > pos=. > SEX = "f" ill = 0 > > In other words the question is how to read ",.," should it be: > Option 1: as 0.0 (which is current behaviour) > or Option 2: . > > Any comments on desired behaviour appreciated. > > regards > > Jens Lauritsen > EpiData Association > _______________________________________________ > EpiData-list mailing list > EpiData-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca > http://lists.umanitoba.ca/mailman/listinfo/epidata-list _______________________________________________ EpiData-list mailing list EpiData-list(a)lists.umanitoba.ca http://lists.umanitoba.ca/mailman/listinfo/epidata-list

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Re: [EpiData-list] How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 10 Mar '06

10 Mar '06

Hi every body, Yes, a missing value is a missing value and has no sense to convert it into 0. Option 2. Greetings Pedro Pedro Arias Bohigas John Ericssons gatan, 12 5 tr 112 22 Stockholm Sweden Phone (cell) 0734421130 Phone (international calls)+46734421130

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How should EpiData Analysis read a CSV (Comma Separated File)
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 10 Mar '06

10 Mar '06

A question has come up. Please consider how you find reading of a CSV file in analysis appropriate: In a csv file the following data is found: id, s, pos, sex, ill 1,.,.,f,0 2...... etc (rest of records) The data in line can be interpreted in two ways: Option 1: ID= 1 s= 0.0 pos=0.0 SEX = "f" ill = 0 Option 2: ID= 1 s= . pos=. SEX = "f" ill = 0 In other words the question is how to read ",.," should it be: Option 1: as 0.0 (which is current behaviour) or Option 2: . Any comments on desired behaviour appreciated. regards Jens Lauritsen EpiData Association

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/inc and /xmin /xmax in bar and histogram
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 27 Feb '06

27 Feb '06

These options have no place in bar and histograph Example 1 : /XMIN="0" /XMAX="10" /XINC=1 Example 2 : /XMIN="0" /XMAX="10" /XINC="1" and will be removed from the graph create form. bar: A bar uses only the values of the group variable assumed categorical. And each value represented in the data will be shown. A small space will separate the bars. Histogram Unless you use the option /Xonly a histogram uses all values from minimum to maximum value and fills in any intermediate value not found in the data. E.g. if data in variable V1 has values 10 20 30. : histogram v1 The histogram will show a bar with counts of observations at x=10 x=20 and x=30, and will show the values 11,12....19 21....29 without any bar. With : his v1 /xonly A condensed histogram will show with only values 10,20 and 30 and without space between the bars. regards Jens Lauritsen EpiData Association

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EpiData-List: List index out of bounds
by epidata-list＠lists.umanitoba.ca 22 Feb '06

22 Feb '06

"When I try to open a newly created .rec-file for data entry I receive the error message "list index out of bounds (9174)". When such errors occur it is good practice to confirm that you are using latest version - 3.1 Jan 12th 2006: (120106) If not download latest and try again. regards Jens Lauritsen

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